Still a Virgin
If you are one of the people who thinks I whine to much you will not like this post so do not read it.
After my last post I was strong for a while. It helped very much that I had made my decisions about what I want to do. The decision to have sex if an appropriate chance falls in my path helped because at least I know who I am and what my choices would be. I do not any more have the weight of confusion on me. If a man comes along who could be my husband I will go down that path to it's fullest. And if a man comes along who could be a good sexual partner for me I will go down that path without being confused about what I want to do. I have decided and that feels right.
It does not feel good to realize now many months later that perhaps neither of those opportunities will ever come into my life. I may never have a chance to make the choice.
I am ready for a "friends with benefits" situation but do not know how to arrange or ask for such a thing. The men who are my friends are too religious for me to ask this of them and besides if they were attracted to me I assume they would have wanted to date me. I do not want to hear from another man I respect and like that he is not attracted to me.
The men who are not my friends but might be open to a sexual relationship that is non-religious men ( I have met some from internet dating) freak out when they find out I have never had sex. They do not want the responsibility of being my "first" or they assume I must have strange sexual issues they do not want to be involved with, which might be true but I do not have a way to find out.
Some readers warned this might be the case, they warned that men in their 40's who are not religious, by the time they reach their 40's they do not necessarily want just sex anymore they want a real relationship, and the idea of a relationship with me feels too intense for them especially since religion is still very important to me.
I do not have the social or sexual tools to solve this problem. Like I said before I do not want to have sex with someone I will never see again or someone I have to pay. I do accept that if I do not meet someone within those limits I will just have to be a virgin when I die. I would rather be a virgin than do something outside the limits I know would make me happier. But it is hard to accept that I do not know how to find someone within those limits. I feel like a baby flailing around with no idea how to do things that come naturally to everyone else.
Also, I have not found someone to date (as in a real relationship that involves love and maybe later marriage) either. It is not easy to be an Orthodox woman in her 40s and it is even more difficult if you are not slender enough. I am offered to be set up perhaps twice or three times a year and usually the matchmakers start with an apology that they know the man does not meet even my few basic criteria. I usually agree to meet the man anyway or at least speak on the phone because I want to be open minded and I do not have many choices but like I have said before I do not want to get married just for the sake of being married, I want to get married because I love the person and he loves me, and. . . well I am trying to be open minded but it is very very difficult.
I am realizing that there is a very very real chance that I might never know in this lifetime what it feels like to be fully in love and that I might never know in this lifetime what it feels like to be in a full physical relationship with another human being. No matter how much I want it there are some things I might never know and never experience. I feel ugly and unwanted and I cry myself to sleep often even though most people who know me during the day would never know that.
I remember my parents telling me that life is not fair. Only in the last few months I realized more and more what that means. There is no response to it. There is no answer. Simply, life is not fair.
Update a few days later . . . . I have gotten some very nice emails from readers about this post. Each one nicer than the next. Thank you. The email made me realize the question I have. Exactly what should I say? If you are an otherwise Orthodox man who maybe is also a virgin or maybe has had one or two partners but in any case is very private about these things . . . or if you used to be Orthodox and now are not . . . or if you were never Orthodox but you are meeting an Orthodox woman you met through a dating website . . . what should someone like me (a woman you know from the community or maybe a pretty close friend . . . or someone you have met once or twice because you were set up or met online) say to bring up the subject of sex and see whether you might be open to helping each other be less lonely and sexually frustrated? How can I bring it up and still have my dignity if the man is not interested either because he is not attracted to me or because he is too religious to say yes? What if he is someone I have to see in the neighborhood whether he says yes or no, so I would feel awkward if he says no? People are telling me to be calm and natural but I have no idea what words to use in different circumstances. You can leave a comment here or send an email to shomernegiah@gmail.com but I hope you will leave a comment so that other people in the same position as me can see it too.
posted by Shomer Negiah at 3/18/2012 01:06:00 PM
54 Comments:
there are many good, trustworthy, off-the-derech type people on secular dating sites (don't bother with jdate) who at least partially share your experience. more people understand you than you think, and although I don't blame you for not wanting to complicate things with your friends, there is no reason for you not to forge a meaningful relationship with someone not currently in your daily sphere. put yourself out there! I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
"The men who are my friends are too religious for me to ask this of them and besides if they were attracted to me I assume they would have wanted to date me."
My advice is never assume.
As you said yourself, after a certain age, if we're still single then being shomer negia is by default and not by design. I'm not making excuses for it, but that's the way it is. Of course, based on what society expects, we don't dare say that out loud, so we're all stuck being frustrated.
If there's a guy who you think might be a candidate (even if he seems too religious) try to find a way to bring up the subject. (If only there were a blog that you could mention in conversation and see how he reacts....) Find an excuse to sit next to him and "accidentally" bang into him. Most guys will be too conditioned to respond (or too brainwashed and/or chicken to do anything), but it's worth a try.
Also, just because a guy hasn't approached you and asked you out doesn't mean that he's not interested in dating you, but that's a whole other story.
>>I am ready for a "friends with benefits" situation but do not know how to arrange or ask for such a thing. The men who are my friends are too religious for me to ask this of them and besides if they were attracted to me I assume they would have wanted to date me. I do not want to hear from another man I respect and like that he is not attracted to me.
The men who are not my friends but might be open to a sexual relationship that is non-religious men ( I have met some from internet dating) freak out when they find out I have never had sex. They do not want the responsibility of being my "first" or they assume I must have strange sexual issues they do not want to be involved with, which might be true but I do not have a way to find out. <<
You need to relax. Your not a child any more and sex is a natural thing for adults. Frankly, you are likely to find a man with frum leaning who you will like, but you need to breath deeply and be a little more confident.
I can't tell exactly what types of situations have come your way, but you may have good results if you don't wait for men to make the first move. Older single men are often shy, and they may not know how to make the first move, especially if they grew up in yeshivish backgrounds. And sometimes it might take several attempts: maybe you hug someone, and he hugs back only weakly, but that could mean that he's not interested or it could mean that he's nervous. In the era of "he's just not that into you" and having been rejected myself many times, I thought that the second possibility (being nervous) was not likely, especially if it happened many times in a row, but actually it does happen that a man is perfectly masculine and assertive in a relationship, but he might be really shy on the way into the relationship. And it is scary to put yourself out on a limb, but I always remember the proverbial story of the ugly guy who is always getting laid in college: he gets turned down 95% of the time, but that 5% of women who accept him is enough. And it gets easier with practice. And it's even easier if you feel self-confident. I hope that you find something to increase your confidence in yourself, rock climbing, heavy weight lifting, something that makes you feel strong and accomplished, no matter what your weight is. Lots of beautiful, strong, confident women who aren't small, and they blog and post on the internet and have a good community.
Thanks for the update. I am close to your age, have been reading your blog since it began, and at times I felt like there was no hope for me, and I was thinking of "settling", but I finally met a man just a couple years older who I believe is truly my bashert. I hope that you do too. I learned so much from reading books written by older former-singles, like Rachel Greenwald and even an evangelical psychologist Henry Cloud. If you're thinking "I'm happy for this commenter, but that's unlikely to work for me," (something that I have thought about others' similar statements many many many times), I will also add that I learned not to think defeatist thoughts like that from reading cognitive therapy books like _Feeling Good_.
BS"D
Shalom "Nice Jewish girl",
reading the first page of your blog makes me say "ow".....and it hurts me seeing a Jewish woman fight this inner struggle.
But, on the other hand...being virgin is NOT a shame.....I was virgin (as man) till age 27, which is very late for men in Europe.
And being virgin gives you, from the Jewish spiritual perspective, more power in prayer and good deeds.
Perhaps this is not the appropiate place at all , but I am single, Jewish (orthodox), from Europe, 41 years, divorced (from a mentally sick woman), high educated, speak some languages, now "looking" but not actively searching.
Sexuality is an important aspect of Jewish marriage, so on that point I am willing to assist, but only within the boundaries of marriage or a long-term relationship, not for a one-night stand.
The thing is that I would require my future "wife" to make Aliyah and start living in Israel.
There is much more to say about me, but not here.
One thing, please do not give up hope and DO NOT waste virginity as a burden for a single sexual event (I did it in the past before marriage, and I still have regrets). The more this counts for women.
If interested feel free to contact me
Despite what the movies and fraternity life leads us to believe, I think most decent men won't just have sex w/ any random woman. If they would, they've probably been w/ so many by now, you would contract a STD by just sharing breathing space.
With that being said, I think it would be just plain awkward to be w/ any guy & ask about having sex flat-out. There needs to be some flirtation, some playfulness involved, and it sometimes takes time until you get to the stage of sex.
I'm saying this because I also was shomer negiya for a long time, and when the opportunity arose for sex, I went for it, and completely went crazy with guilt afterwards. I felt like I forced myself into smthg I wasn't ready for, and I had tremendous guilt about being a 'frum' person & yet doing such a thing. I had to work for years on that guilt issue until I felt confident in either being w/ more men (which I did in the past) or deciding that I don't want to continue doing that until I'm either engaged or married.
My focus for many years was about how I had never kissed a guy, never been w/ a guy, and I obsessed about it, but stemmed from very low confidence... a poor self-image that turned off many guys.
I know you said this was a rant, but I sense a lot of self-pity in the post... Perhaps if you work on being more confident, you will begin to radiate a more sexy 'aura', and if you start socializing in more liberal, open communities, you will attract a guy and it will develop into a sexual relationship.
I just think that after so much time of focus on being shomer, marriage, etc, jumping right into sex w/ someone won't have a healthy outcome. You won't enjoy it and it won't be satisfying for you. Unless you can just relate to it as another thing you had to do for the day (and only the gross frat guy can do that).
I think you should contact bar pinchas :-) he sounds nice...
Why would you tell someone you're a virgin?
Just to give you some hope: A 41 year old frum female professional colleague just got married for the first time to a really nice man just over a week ago. Another 41 year old female never married professional colleague just got engaged. And my wife got married for the first time at age 44 -- to me. :) Don't give up hope!
Hi,
I read through some parts of your blog and saw some people writing comments that weren't so nice.
I just wanted to tell you that I don't judge you. I cannot understand your situation because I'm still quite young and hopefully I will never be in that situation, but even though that is the case it doesn't mean that I don't feel your pain.
Sometimes people don't need criticisms, judgments or suggestions. They just need people who care and who feel their pain for them. I care about you because you're my sister like every other jewish girl, and I feel sad with you.
You're not alone.
I literally just came across your blog and I love it. My middle name is virgin! It is my personal choice to remain a virgin until I am married. I am 25 years old. I would for you or anybody else to check out my blog.
http://thehappyvirgin.blogspot.com
Just started it!
Dear nice jewish girl,
Do you still live in America or are you in Israel? If you're in America and by the NYC area you should join Footsteps. It is to help people who come from very religious families and no longer feel they should be part of that world. This program helps them adjust to real life. The reason I point this out to you is it can open up a world of opportunities for you in terms of available men who come from a similar background and may be looking for the same thing you are. Look into it: footsteps.
i related to every last word you said here. including not knowing how to find the "friend with benefits". but i disagree with the commenter who claimed you are full of self pity- if you are its for good reason and theres nothing that will take it away until you find love. ive given up hope but maybe just maybe something good can still happen to us.
I just love the "don't give up hope" and "You're too down on yourself; be positive" comments. (Yes, I'm being sarcastic.) Do you just not have any idea how much it hurts to just be unwanted and unloved? Let me tell you it sucks. How in the world are you supposed to "be more confident" when you have NOTHING to find confidence in? And to have people say, "Oh, just be patient" is just annoying.
I hope all the best for this blogger and as I have travelled down a similar path I so much appreciate her sharing thorugh her blog. The above is not to discourage her (the vast majority of people don't die virgins/having never married). All the comments just hit a truly sore spot.
Shomer Negiah, feel free to remove my comment. I just needed to say it.
I don't know what other way to put it, but it just totally sucks.
It totally sucks that you are in this situation thats not within your control.
Worse thing yet is that its just a biological fluke. More men are born than women, but by the age of 18, there is a 1:1 ratio between us. Any age increase will see more men die than women from accidents, and disease, leaving some women without a man.
Then there's the whole theory that more men are going OTD.
I was web browsing, found your blog, and read it. I'm very sorry about your situation and will daven for you bli neder.
However, I want you to know that you are beautiful and incredible. With a nisayon this big, it's impossible not to see how much you've overcome already, and please, don't give up.
You are more than just a body though, you are a beautiful neshama with incredible nisyonot, and you should know that what's hardest for you is your tafkid. Please, keep fighting, but by the Torah's standards.
Hi there,
I just came across your blog and have only read a little bit, so the answer to my question may be written where i have not yet seen. But have you considered working with a therapist? This question comes out of support, not judgment. I am a Jewish therapist (raised modern orthodox, currently conservative, so i understand our histories are very different,) and I work with many single Orthodox women about their feelings around their self-image, their sexuality, and finding love. Talking out lout with a non-judging, supportive individual has been helpful to the women I see in my practice.
Just a thought. I wish you the very best.
Don't panic. You have a lot of life ahead of you. I got married at 39 and was a virgin prior to that. (Actually, before I met my wife, I was too timid even to hold a woman's hand. It seemed like a huge hurdle that I just could never cross...) So there's always hope, and at any moment you could meet the right person. Also, it's not worth spending too much time going over and over the things you think you are currently missing out on. You might not believe me, but chances are good that you are significantly over-building these things in your mind. Kissing and sex and all that stuff are good, but there are many other things in the world that are better, like kindness and charity and empathy. And those opportunities are ever-present, and they lead to other good things, and to other good people.
Hi there.
I stumbled across your blog this afternoon and it touched me deeply. I just wanted you to know.
Unfortunately, I cannot offer any wise words and I don't want to trade in platitudes, which you've no doubt heard too many times already, but perhaps it will be a little gratfiying to know that your words and experience has affected a complete stranger.
I won't go into detail. You do not need to be burdened with too much of my story, but I'll briefly explain my background as it may shed some light on the genuine empathy I feel for you.
I am a non-religious Jewish male, 40 years old. Heterosexual. Although I have experienced physical intimacy, it has been seldom.
More significantly for me, in all my years, I have never experienced a serious and ongoing relationship with someone. In many respects I am a relationship 'virgin'. Over the years I have developed confidence and self-esteem issues which have doubtless made things more difficult.
Consequently, I genuinely have no idea what it would be like to have a wife, or significant life partner if we're being very 21st century about things. I am certain I know what it's like to love another dearly, but I have never enjoyed or benefited from that feeling being reciprocated. It is a source of great sadness and angst for me.
My bachelorhood means I live with the feeling that I'm different from most and this difference is inexplicable, that I'm somehow not good enough for anyone else. I live with the knowledge that there is a lack in my life that has never been filled. Nor do I know at this point in time whether this will ever change. Sometimes it's OK. Sometimes I am filled with fury and a sense of injustice. Sometimes desolation.
I do pray (in my own irreligous way) that things will change. Meantime, life goes on and I work hard to count my blessings in all other respects.
I do not seek anything from you in terms of advice or words of solace. Nor do I want to burden you with my story. I hope you don't feel that this is the case, but I haven't ever read anything that has such candour and I certainly haven't read anything ever that's resonated so fully, so I felt compelled to send a comment.
I think you are incredibly brave to write your blog, even anonymously. I admire your honesty. I would like to 'come out' to the world as a relationship 'virgin', but like you I prefer not to. I'm sure you understand. I just want to thank you for writing your blog and I sincerely hope you find the happiness and fulfilment - emotional, physical and spiritual -that it sounds like you deserve.
Thank you.
You do not have to shoulder this alone! You are a bright, articulate, self-aware girl who is asking all the right questions and just needs help discovering the answers. There are several exceptional orthodox PsyD folks in NYC who deal almost exclusively with orthodox singles and are very sympathetic to the excruciating challenge of being orthodox, single, and yes, a virgin. Please consider meeting with one of them - the right person can give you an entirely new insight sometimes, and that may be able to provide you with the answers you need!
I admire your honesty and strength of mind. I am wishing the best for you. This is an emotionally difficult situation and you're facing it with great integrity. It isn't easy, but please keep trying, keep exploring your options. I think what you want is very reasonable and human, and there really are good people out there who are open to healthy sex with you. In terms of some social advice, I would suggest bringing up your virginity slightly later, perhaps on the fourth meeting rather than the first/second. If you and the person you're seeing enjoy each others' company for several meetings without pressure, it raises the chance of naturally leading to sex significantly.
The only solution is a nice Jewish vampire. Take a look at "Interview with a Jewish Vampire" by Erica Manfred (available on Amazon) At least you'll have a laugh while looking for love. The book is a love story about Norma Katzman a zaftig middle aged Jewish girl who meets Sheldon,a drop-dead gorgeous vampire on Jdate. They have a passionate romance while turning her mother into a vampire. Go know!
Another suggestion: Watch "Girls" a show on HBO with a character named Shoshana, a Jewish virgin who is trying desperately to get laid but men are turned off by her virginity. Another very funny show.
Beware of the guy who wants to meet you whose wife was "crazy." I write about divorce as well as Jewish Vampires and find that men who divorced "crazy" wives usually drove them crazy.
have you considered a page break it's where someone gets on your website and there is a read more button where you stop.
O yea i'm going through the same thing or some what.
In my experience, frum men can sometimes be the most superficial. I believe this to be rooted in the lack of social contact between the sexes in adolescence, the men never meet enough women to learn what they like or don't like. Instead, it's jut assume that skinny+young=attractive. In the secular Jewish world this is not the case!!!! Men of all ages have a variety of different tastes and preferences. Though not Torah observant, many of these men still love being Jewish and would be open to incorporating more Halachos into their routines. So try to give secular Jewish men a chance, don't immediately discuss being a virgin (this should be something you reveal at a much later stage), be confident, dress your best features. Also it's my personal experience that an older man may appreciate you more. 10-15 years older can make for a beautiful dynamic. Also, not every guy you meet needs to be attracted to you- not everybody likes everything- but your besheret WILL be attracted (and he's only one man who you haven't met yet). Remember, many secular Jews care about religion- but they just might be freaked out by the virgin confession if you reveal it too soon.
Hi,
This probably won't mean anything to you because you've heard it, but here goes!
Sweetheart, you are a beautiful, intelligent, Jewish woman. I have so, so much respect for your decisions and actions. You are SO strong, I cannot put into words. I am a 22 year old orthodox women and I am engaged, though, I am not shomer nagiah. This is one of many reasons I respect you so much! You truly are so amazing! Stay strong! Never forget to think before you act! You are so beautiful, I really can tell! Shabbat Shalom!
Kol HaKavod!
email- blemj1@aol.com
Don't worry! You are an amazing woman! I am 32 years old S.N. never been kissed and only have had two real "boyfriends". I feel your pain, just know that you are not alone and that you are most certainly in my prayers!
Love always, BJ
Hello, :)
I have been reading your blogs and I have really taken interest and hope you post soon-
Anyways,
I understand what you are feeling because I was shomer nagiah l, even though I am married now, before I met my husband I got tired of the whole feeling and there was this one guy that I dated for a while. He convinced me to do something for him. One thing led to another and we had sex. He did not force me, it was just as much his choice as it was mine. In fact I was pleasures and excited. After it happened I thought all my sexual tension would be released my wouldn't be "horny" anymore or whatever you might say. I was right I wasn't horny anymore, but I alsI wasn't fulfilled either. I realized that I was just so upset nervous about being older and never even TOUCHED a boy so I broke away, had sex, didn't solve anything.
So basically what I'm trying to say is, even though this may feel so real and like you just NEED someone to make love to, you don't. It's all made up in your head because of the deprivation. Well, that's at least what it was for me.
Antways I just wanted to share my experience with you because I wouldn't want you to feel liike you've wasted all the years being shomer, because thats how I felt.
I'm a male, Gentile, older than you, and in my second marriage.
Notice how on the one hand that makes it easier for you to stop reading, and on the other helps you assess whatever else I might say?
I divorced after a long marriage. Although I was no virgin, it had been decades since I dated, and my self-esteem was not the highest. Like you, I looked at some online dating sites, and on one I found a woman's profile that included this statement:
"It's okay if you have some baggage, as long as it fits beneath the seat in front of you, or in the overhead compartment."
What that said to me--what connected with me--is that everybody's got baggage. What matters is how much of it they're carrying--or dragging--with them.
I am not saying you carry too much. How could I? I know you only through your posts. What I have seen is your brave, public questioning, and more recently your re-examination of what works and what does not work in your life.
I do think that to some extend meeting people is what salespeople call a numbers game: you meet 100, of whom let's say 10 become acquaintances that you see from time to time, and of those let's say 2 become friends.
Do what you love, and find things that you love that put you in contact with men who might love them also.
I have a single relative who's (let's say) a children's therapist. She's a sole practitioner, so has no real coworkers. She meets mainly the mothers of children, and of could the children who are her clients.
She's active in a book club and one or two other groups, but these are almost exclusively women. So she has about as much chance of meeting a potentially compatible man in her circumstance as I have of meeting a left-handed, redheaded Sikh from Oregon (I'm on the east coast).
"and the idea of a relationship with me feels too intense for them especially since religion is still very important to me."
I don't get why this should be a problem if you are religious and they aren't. You're going to have sex with them. And mostly do normal things they do too. You won't dance in public maybe. Fine, who the hell cares? I don't see why this should be a problem as long as you don't make it a problem or impinge on the other person with it. I am a man. Please trust me on this, if the guy wants to be in a relationship with you, you having a coke at Wendy's while he gets a burger wont make a difference. You're hanging out, not judging him. It's like if you had diabetes. If he was a normal human being and liked you as a person, he would understand you don't eat carbs. Big fuckin deal. Seriously NJG, dont even worry about this one. This one you're not seeing clearly.
Its funny - after being married to someone who has sex addiction for 6 years - I have a really hard time relating to a woman who'd just be with a guy who just wants her for her body and nothing else. There's nothing more grosse than the feeling after you're with someone who doesn't respect you as a person and only wants you as a body.
In today's society we're given the illusion that being a virgin is so bad - and there must be something wrong with you - we're sold the story of women with "hot bodies" are the only ones that can "get" any guy. What are they getting? Some attention? some release? Its not real - and it doesn't relieve you of anything.
If sex is on the top of your list of things to do - its really not that hard - but don't go with the illusion that you'll feel better for it. It sounds like you've been looking for for many years for a real meaningful relationship that you can truly love someone and be with them - so don't give up!! You're beshert is out there for you. Be thankful that for all these years you weren't going through some crazy abusive relationship that's left you a broken shell that so many women have and are going through... just be strong and find the right guy. And yes its totally ok to make the first move as some people said... guys happen to be really super shy in that area ;)
Hatzlacha - and I really wish you success in whatever you decide to do in your future..
I am in something of a similar situation, although for some time now I have been starting to explore my own sexuality. Not to sound too kinky, but I would highly recommend to get "Sex for One" by Betty Dodson. Although the language is very explicit, it carries some very important points across. It is not helpful for you or your future mate if you have no clue about your needs, and you should not depend on someone's goodwill or intuition.
Of course this does not solve the no-partner problem, but it takes away pressure (lots of it). Good luck!
Hi, I found this website by googling "jewish women are too picky". This was a pleasant surprise. However, to be frank, I live in northern California. Most women (who are mostly reform) here are married or not interested in me.
I would be happy to meet anyone, but it seems impossible. Maybe you just live in a bad area, like me...
I agree with lifelover
that was beautifully said, and I'am with you too
I feel your pain nice jewish girl.
stay strong. keep positive, even if you cry that does not mean that you are not keeping positive, everyone is permitted slip ups when it comes to positive thinking.
If worst comes to worst I'd advise you to seek a sexual surrogate. They are certified and often work in conjunction with therapists (not that you should see a therapist but usually you can only get a surrogate through a therapist contact). They are not prostitutes but help work through relationship problems or whatever may be causing you not to find that connection with someone, your self-esteem issues and all that. You can read about their line of work.
Does it really matter if you are a virgin? I've always seen that as something good. It's true that I'm still 19 years old, though many people my age already say that they had sex and what not, but I've never felt that urge, really. I've always been a good christian guy who regards masturbation and fantasizing as wrong alongsied fornication. So that's why I say that being a virgin and being single doesn't have anything wrong. It's that you appear to want to have sex because you can't stand the urge, from what I've understood about your blog anyway. But don't feel bad for being a virgin. Sadly many people with destructive thoughts think of being single at this age as something wrong, however seeing how many divorce it seems as if singleness is something desired. Also, why don't you value your virginity anyway? I do that, chastity is in today's world an underrated virtue, and seeing what you have been going through, it is something admirable from your part. You have probably been told this before, but I just think that it is something important to stress out in our current decadent culture. You also mention that you would take friends with benefits, but wouldn't that be going against jewish precepts? Also, why your urge for sex? Is it really that important? Nobody has died for not having sex, although you also appear to long for love. But, if I told you that controlling your urge or even suppressing your urge for sex, would you feel offended? Because really, sex is kind of overrated. The world has many wonders to be worrying about just a few moments of pleasure. I consider something wrong that people try to have sex and are desperate for it. It is like being desperate for alcohol even though you don't need it to live. I may sound harsh, and I deeply apologize if I do, it is not my intention, although it's true I'm trying to be bold. I don't want to make you feel bad or anything and it is your life after all. But you say you are jewish and you say religion is important, so why haven't you contemplated a life of devotion to God instead of marriage? Jews don't have monasteries or convents, true, but you don't need that. Contemplating God's works, praying, going to synagogues, doing charity, theologizing and philosophising, reading the Bible and other religious works, going for walks into nature or contemplating God's love. A life of contemplation to God and full devotion to Him can make you forget about an urge that is only harming you rather than helping you. Possibly you are doing these things already, although I've always held the belief that dedicating fully to God can make you overcome sexual desire. Stop being depressed for not having sex and enjoy your life. I think you are suffering much more by trying to satisfy your lust that for not satisfying it.
I think what you have decided to do is a very bad thing. Not because it is unreasonable, but because it is something that will only make you more frustrated. Not to mention, that you will loose your purity, which is very important for a woman who follows Hebrew ways. Sex without emotional and spiritual connection is worse than masturbation (just in case you were wondering). I know that if you have made up your mind, nothing is going to change it, but if I were you I would continue to stay pure even if it means that you would die without ever having sex.
Purity of a woman is a very important part of Hebrew way, as the Levites were not allowed to marry someone who has lost that purity (its Leviticus 21:13-15).
Perhaps you have been destined for a righteous Levite, and if you will loose your purity you may actually loose your only chance in life to be truly happy.
I just came upon this posting thru a link from another blog. I am so so sorry you are going through so much pain. I know how hard it can be, and as much as I also believe that you have so much life and happiness still ahead of you, I know how hollow that can sound. I just wanted to let you know that I heard your voice, and that I wish so much happiness for you.
You'd be surprised.... Frum men are a lot more interested in sex than they let on. The rules change after 30. The problem is they think as a frum woman YOU will turn them down with disgust. So you have to offer hints that you really aren't so straitlaced. wear clothing that doesn't go exaclty according the rules. get used to giving friendly hugs to males, taps on the shoulder etc and so forth. But don't have sex with anyone you don't want to. If you aren't feelin the feelin it's your right to stop at any point you feel like and no one has the right to demand that you do more. Do it when you are feeling it.
Hay just came across your blog. U sound like a very special person. I feel your pain. I'm in a similar but not exactly the same situation. I wud love to hear more about u and where ur holding now. Its almost a year since ur last blog. Please drop me an email. My address is moshepipik123@gmail.com. Can't wait to hear from u! Good luck!
Hi,
Through what you describe, do you think you have aspergers, a form of autism? Many people with asperger's have average to above intelligence, and they describe many of the things you do, like dating is complete mystery to them. Many jewish people have aspergers.
"I feel ugly and unwanted and I cry myself to sleep often even though most people who know me during the day would never know that."
I am very sad to read that. G_d is not the architect of suffering, nor the bringer of loneliness - at least, not on purpose.
I have posted elsewhere. I believe that G_d gives LIFE, but we get tumbled up in the day to day and the rules of this little planet and all its vicissitudes.
I am a straight Catholic heterosexual male physician, not deformed or anything - and I have been on no more than a dozen dates in my lifetime, which is now long. There is something in whom G_d made, that makes such things happen. Even when I did not seem so sure that there WAS a G_d, I had these laws, you call Shomer Negiah, I know those laws as modesty and propriety.
I even grew up in the American dioceses where degenerate priests were warning about sex, and schtupping the boys.
Shomer Negiah is not about "UGLY." We are the way we are, and G_d made life, but not the vicissitudes of the world, I believe.
Suffer, but do not suffer voluntarily. Do not waste life wishing you were different. G_d even gave me a sex drive, and no real conscious guilt about sex. For some reason, though, the Law is the Law. I was never asked to like it. I wish, sometimes.
Why do I post here? A little persistent crush on Sarah Silverman, and her interview in HEEB was very entertaining. I wandered here.
I pray for peace in your heart. Be beautiful.
One more thing....
SEX is a great power in human life, that we all fear and do not understand, that makes for ceremony and symbol wherever we humans go, and whatever we believe.
Do not shame yourself for knowing that it is an awesome force. Shame yourself instead because you do not know the secrets of how to control volcanoes and tsunamis and hurricanes, that makes as much sense. Some fools will go to the beach in a hurricane with amulets and trinkets, and pretend that they can control the very waves...
If G_d has given you a life that is bigger than the comfortable living of it....I understand.
"Some are born to sweet delight..."
Jim Morrison, THE DOORS
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I came across this article and thought of you. http://www.foxnews.com/health/2011/09/06/use-surrogate-sex-partners-rising-among-women/
I respect that you don't want to pay for sex, so a sex surrogate therapist might not be the ideal solution for you. But it does sound like some other people in similar positions have had rewarding experiences this way. Maybe it's an option to consider. Best of luck! I hope you'll update when you feel ready :)
Hi Shomer! How are you doing? I would love to know if your situation has changed. Best of luck, friend. I am sure that wherever you are, you are much loved. If not by a lover, then by many else. Praying for you.
Rambam, Mishnah Torah, Hilchot Teshuvah, chapter 9, paragraph 1:
The Torah promised us that if we do it [the mitzvot] WITH JOY AND A CHEERFUL ATTITUDE and think about its wisdom every day, that He will remove from us all the things that prevent us from performing it [the Torah], for example: sickness, war, famine and similar things.
And He will shower on us all the good things that increase our ability [literally, strengthen our hands] to perform the Torah, like: sufficient food, peace and abundant money [literally, silver and gold], so we should not spend all our days on our physical needs.
Instead, we will be free to sit and study its wisdom and perform its mitzvot, in order to merit the afterlife of the righteous [literally, the World to Come].
dear first of all i congrate you for beeing a decent girl, and second i advice you to search the other half first and after to think about sex,coz is a major step and shoudnt be done whit anyone like most of people often do it.
if you wanna talk whit me you can mail me
pure_sentimental@ymail.com
wish u all the best
greetings from romania
Hi,
I hope you (eventually) see this post.
I followed your blog for a good few years but never commented. There were time that as an orthodox single woman, I strongly identified with your pain and dilemmas and I didn't have any answers to this incredibly difficult situation.
I am now married and I still don't have any answers for you. However, I have learned something that may help with one issue that you're facing - the sexual frustration. I can tell you that birth control pills majorly reduce sexual desire. Kind of ironic, but it's definitely my experience. I know this won't help you overcome the feelings of loneliness and the emotional side of being single, but it might be worth a try to help reduce your sexual frustration. Just an idea.
Oh boy. no idea where to start, so I'll just type.. Well, you could try some of these tips: http://www.wikihow.com/Be-More-Attractive-to-Men
or even this:
http://www.lovelyish.com/2010/12/04/6-subliminal-tricks-to-be-more-attractive-to-men/
or just do the obvious: change your mindset. As a guy who comes from a religious family, and spent 3 years in yeshiva, I know exactly where you come from. After the age of 16 I left the Orthodox world, and started living a completely secular life. And guess what: I discovered that sex ISN'T SUCH A BIG DEAL! Sure, it's fun. And sure, it makes you feel good about yourself, appreciated, satisfied, it lifts your spirit, etc. But in the end... it's just sex. Thats all.
Now i know you find it hard to believe, but you have to understand that you grew up in this environment thats makes the whole sex issue way bigger than it is, and completely out of proportion.
The minute you stop being obssesed about it, the minute you'll let it go and free yourself, you will feel a heavy burden lift off your shoulders. And like all the other things in life, the minute you stop looking for it, it will cross your path. It might take a day or two, or even a month or two, maybe even half a year, but eventually it will happen. And you know why? Because guys will notice it. They will see you being more confident, they will notice your firmer posture and spirit (of course, you are much lighter now without that burden :) and will look at you in a whole new way.
Just get out of this prison you created for yourself, and it will happen, don't worry.
Good luck finding your happines, and a last tip: just don't tell the guys you are dating that you are still a virgin. They will find out soon enough, and if they run, let them go.Probably it was'nt meant to be. The guy that will stay will be the lucky one...
Do Orthodox Jews see sex outside of marriage as a sin? If you want to sin or if your opinion is different about the sinfulness of sex then why worry about how religious a man is? Someone you like who likes you and who will be nice to you would be good. You only find out who likes who by talking to people. Do things you are interested in that will allow you to meet people with the same interests. If you feel your appearance holds you back change your appearance. Diet, exercise, grooming tips at a makeup store or at a salon might help. Maybe change your clothes.
Exercise and yoga improve appearance and how you feel inside. People who feel good are more attractive to others.
I read some genealogical information about my family, an arranged marriage. The wife died and my ancestor married again but he named a daughter after his dead wife so he must have grown to love her. Marrying someone you like, sex and familiarity can turn into love and if you like yourself and your spouse you ought to like your children. Loving children is automatic, liking them isn't.
Hey. There's a clip of Louis ck on YouTube entitled "skinny guys". I thought it was really funny. Btw I'm a 34 yr old boy who's never been sexual with someone either if that makes u feel better :). Much blessing and happiness for you. Be well
I'm a 39 year old virgin man. I know how it feels. I'm quite public about it. I have met many virgin women but if the spark is not there, then it is not right. The oldest was in her 50's. I believe in spiritual marriage. Ignore the calls of the animal. HaShem is male and female. Follow the voice of the male eternal.
I am anxiously waiting for you to update... hope everything is well.
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